Before becoming the 10th Commander of the Multi National Joint Task Force (MNJTF) in Chad, General Ibrahim Ali was the last theatre commander (TC) of operation Hadin Kai in North East Nigeria. He succeeded in getting three Chibok ladies with their kids out of the Sambisa and vowed to get Lear Sharibu anywhere credible intelligence can locate her. He spoke with SAM KAYODE of metrowatchonline.com newspaper just before proceeding to his present command in N’djamena.
General before I proceed to matters of this war theatre, i would want you to compare and contrast your last command and “Hadin Kai” which you are about leaving after only 6 months.
The level of threat in Jos 3 Division area is quite different from the one in the North East Theatre Command. Because we know that the threats in the Theatre Command are more. This is because in the 3 division area the threats are more like inter communal clashes, you know farmers, herders crisis, kidnapping and cattle rustling and things like that, but here in the Northeast it is insurgency and terrorism. Which is higher in terms of mortality than those ones. So it was not easy but I came with the experience I had from Jos, and before getting to Jos, I have been to the Northeast 5 times and this will be my 6th time coming here. So I came with all those experiences I had earlier and it really helped me. I had a fair knowledge of the modus operandi of the insurgents and the terrorists and I was able to counter them. And this time around, we had better equipment to confront the insurgents more than what we used to have when I came earlier in the 5 times I mentioned. So, with the additional and improved equipment level and other platforms, we were able to degrade them to a very appreciable level.
Is it true that the rule of engagement in the 3 division theatre was that soldiers are not allowed to take out anybody even if the bandit is the aggressor messing around with ancestral lands and you are seeing him live?
No!! no! that is not true.. Because I remember the former President, commander in Chief, shortly after I went to Jos especially the early period of my stay there. There was a directive from the Presidency in which the President said that, “any person seen with an AK-47 rifle should be taken out. I remember that vividly and it trickled down the Chain of Command and it came to us. Which was equally sent to all my troops. Any person carrying an AK-47 rifle attacking another community will be taken out.This is because he is an aggressor. And I can tell you, if you check the record, there were a couple of militants that we took out, in Plateau and in Sabon Kaduna. Because I lost, during my stay as a junior officer in 3 division, about 3 to 4 soldiers, if I remember well. So, we cannot sit down and see them eliminating our troops and we say that we are not supposed to fire because of the rule of engagement. It’s not true, any person carrying a weapon, at least an AK-47 rifle, is an aggressor and he should be taken down. And that is what I was doing.The only peculiarity of the Jos area of course, was when you talk about the inter-communal crisis. Communities or tribes fighting themselves we had to come in between. And in that situation, as long as they are not carrying arms we cannot start shooting them. Unless of course if any of the other groups are carrying arms, then definitely you have the go ahead to take them down.
But is it true that mostly in the night beyond Mangu, Riyom, Ganawuri, etc,troops were non-operational just pinned down, which is why the senator representing Plateau South a retired General was saying recently that he wants the defence chief to re-enact the rule of engagement to make them operational during the night too, to counter the bandits who operate mostly in the night or the wee hours of the morning?
No, we carried out patrols, when I was the GOC. You know, I left there almost 6 months ago. When I was a GOC, we carried out patrols in the day time and we carried out our patrols in the night, we did carry out our night patrols. So, I am not aware of the fact that troops just stay confined to their locations. We carried out our patrol both day and night when I was there.
Do we have night patrols or operations here in operation Hadin Kai?
….. Cuts in….. Off course we do.
Except that certain areas are shut down as early as 4pm like the Maiduguri Damaturu road because of the aggression of the insurgents.
Yes, those ones are supply routes, main supply roads. We shut them down for security reasons and that has been going on for a long time. You know. It’s for the security of the civil populace that ply the route that we can control the movement. And we make sure that people are not exposed to attacks.
So, looking at the Northeast theatre that you managed for about 6 months before shipping out. What in your own perception are achievements?
I will just mention a few, there are quite a lot of achievements, several achievements in the 6 months I have stayed. First of all, I and my staff and my officers and men conducted Operation Desert Sanity 2 and Lake Sanity 2. We conducted operation mountain sanity as well. So, these operations have to a large extent degraded the terrorist.
….cuts in….Mountain sanity that is the Mandara stretch in Gwoza.
That is right, Mandara Mountains, we made a lot of recoveries. In Ukoba in Sambisa we made a lot of recoveries. We were able to get very sound intelligence of where they have stashed their arms and ammunition and weapons. The records are there, the photos are there and I am very happy to say that I was able to rescue 3 out of the many Chibok girls that were abducted several years ago. I was able to rescue 3 of them from the operations we conducted. And there were 2 non governmental organizations (NGO) staff that we rescued. Three others have not been seen and we heard that they were killed by the terrorist. So, I am happy those two we were able to rescue them as well. I am talking about those that were picked up in Gamboru Ngala. Also we were able to at least reduce the frequency of attacks on the people, you can attest to the fact that the attacks that we used to experience in the past has reduced from the terrorist attacks. We don’t have such attacks that we are used to any more. So, what they are trying to do now is to attack farmers. Now that they have been degraded to an appreciable level, they are trying to get soft targets like the farmers. And we are taking adequate measures to counter that you know the terrorist once you are able to degrade them. They will look for other exit routes to cause damage. We are happy that we are able to degrade them even though they will always change tactics. So now the tactics that were adopted…… they were trying to kill farmers to stop them from farming this year. And they intensified the use of Improvised Explosive Devices (IEDs) and bombs along our routes of movement. So, we are contending with that as well.
So, what about Lear Sharibu did you get close to her?
Lear Sharibu, we are not sure where she is. We have been getting conflicting information of where exactly she is. But we have not lost hope yet, we think she is alive and definitely if we get good intelligence, we will try to rescue her.
So, what were some of the operational challenges that clogged the progress of troops in sector 2 and 1?
The challenges I experienced, first of all, the issue of equipment. Another challenge is the high attrition rate of the equipment. So, it’s not that the equipment is not available. What I am saying is that the equipment is available but before you know it, they are damaged. How? Because of the bombs encountered, the IEDs on the way, ok. A lot of Emeralds were bombed. Before you know it when we go out for any major operation and come back with the troops, those vehicles would have gone over mines which would damage most parts of the vehicle. We have the time to repair it, so we can deal with the subsequent operations. However, some of them are not going to be repairable at all. So, we need replacements, and this thing takes time. So, these are some of the challenges that we faced .
IEDs have been a major challenge when your predecessor was here. Now you are facing them as a major challenge too. Is there any long term plan to deal with these IEDs once and for all because the insurgents will still do IEDs any way?
Of course, that is the most preferred weapon to the terrorist and the insurgent. Especially now that they don’t have vehicles, they lack arms and ammunition. They have resorted to the widespread use of IEDs. We have just identified counter IED equipment, which the Nigeria Army has purchased and very soon would be deployed in the theatre.
Sector 3 is very peculiar. Lots of meshes, the Tunbus, the Timbuktu triangle. So how did you handle those challenges in Sector 3, is it still IEDs or there are other natural issues other than IEDs and flooding?
Of course, one of the major issues in sector 3 is flooding. So now that we have had some experience in some areas, we have worked out ways to counter it the next time so that it doesn’t happen. By creating dykes, water flooded areas to channel the water when it comes back. So, these are some of the things we have done. And we are clearing the waterways of the hyacinths and the giant grasses. So, this thing will allow us also to be able to freely go through the channel linking the Lake Chad Basin area.
And were you satisfied with the cooperation from your colleagues in the air?
Yes, absolutely yes…….
Cuts in…. At times we see them bombing and produce their own reports outside the theatre, or are those bombing with your command?
Yes, we plan everything with joint operation, you know we plan together. You know, we mostly get the intelligence and we pass it to them to carry out the air rides, yes they do conform to our directives here.
What about the Navy guys in Baga and your amphibious troops. What next for them? What is their plan to end all of this?
The Navy like I said, they are involved in actively clearing the waterways that have been overtaken by the water hyacinths and going forward. They are going to be carrying out more serious amphibious operations in the Lake Chad Basin area.
I believe when you get over there in Chad, there will be a correlation between that side and this side, so that they will be able to weed out the criminals. This is because l learnt that even the Tumbus Island are so many, that nobody actually knows the number of them for effective planning. But I believe you people will take each day as it comes. Is that correct General?
Yes, that is it.
What then is your message to the people of this whole theatre as you are leaving especially concerning the defected insurgents surrendering daily? We have heard so many reports about them, you know, especially now that you are going to the other side of the Lake Chad to do the same job in conjunction with foreign troops.
What I will tell them is they should not look backwards.Of course, they shouldn’t lose hope also, they should continue to give support in times of information and intelligence. They should continue to talk to their brothers that are out their fighting to lay down their arms and come out. I think the Governor has a good heart and he wants the best for them. They should give him a chance and listen to him. They should come out from the bushes and lay down their arms. Now we have over 100, 000 that have surrendered. Over 100,000. I think that is the sign that we are getting to the end of the tunnel. The crisis is coming to an end. Of course, there will be some die hards. But of course, such die hards will find themselves to blame at the end of the day. That is my message to them.
My mind is on the wounded soldiers at the 7division hospital. Are you satisfied with, the facility having spent just 6 months managing the troops? In case you were here for another 6 months. What would you have done differently to the functional medical facility in the barracks?
Of course, it is to improve the hospital by buying more equipment. We can increase and buy more. Even though what we have is adequate and there is a system whereby we move some of them to 44 in Kaduna…… you know. And even Damaturu now, we have few hospitals there. So, we have the capability to take care of the strength of the troops here.
And we believe the new Chief will take care of the tertiary one being built here to ease the pressure on the UMTH and 44?
Of course.
Thank you very much General Ali. Wish you the best.
Thank you.
